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Ancient Cryptography » General » Code of the Week » Double Columnar Transposition

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Phil_The_Rodent

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  • Posts: 41
Double Columnar Transposition
« on: October 03, 2012, 11:11:13 PM »
I REALLY like solving these. Unfortunately, I wanted to have a go at some tonight, and try as I might to find some prepared ones on the net, I had no luck.

But, I don't give up so easily. Instead of hum-bugging the situation, I decided to remedy it. So, here are some transpositions to solve if you want to have a go at them. There is nothing fancy here, just double-columnar transpositions of some interesting phrases (attribution given within the cryptext); also, the keys were randomly generated -- there are no passwords. Additionally, I no longer have the source text and will be saving none of the work so that once they slip out of memory, so I might enjoy them also in a few weeks. So don't ask.

Please don't post any solves, but I've numbered them so you can keep a tally if that appeals to you. Enjoy!

1) NIHWL DGHTT IDENO ATAWS DTHHH SESHW ANSEO EEREF KOPMM OETMT WNOOE DOODG ITDEW MLEYH HENNH EARTU GOITE TNSIT IEOHV UBTCS EHEXE EXTGO KTONH ICPUE DLSEA ESREF NNRST OTIOV LETO
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
2) FWTOR FEIKO HFTOT KWOFE RXONO EREXI ONAAD NRYRM XAREE RTBBA HULBD XNION AEDNR YRMOY NANCH CMAIN EEDOT IANED HOCAC NHM
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
3) SOPER ECHST GISSW LLYAB NAMOE OMCSE YDARN FIEOT ENMSO TSTRH ESYBS HTAAN TKABC NIEOZ RIFUR DEOIY OIGUH TNOAN TSODE ONEBH GLZAE NOGEU IHTIT TAONT ELOHU SDSES IEEOV FRHGW CTINE SZHHC
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
4) BSIII SNAJH GLSLL TTNUH GITBO EHNAI TSRWT LHYEF EORTE DHOAE TGAOD IHWOF GOTWN CNNBT UOYAY TTOEM LHHES ITTWO OIRHE N
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
5) PISNA HEPHN GTCOE EMMON YCHOE TTMYE TWHOT NTITT NAHEE TOPLP FOAAE YTRRL EASNT ANTDH OLSGI IASCP OILMH CEMNN UTATH DEAOI GDSVA CNNIX OPEET DHTPI NLAAC DNTEB TK
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
6) FONNA NTLIE ILUHN GERAD RIEOK TUFBR FLELO LULUA LLNIE TBUMR OEITH GNSAH OMDTN UMOEP OEURT YHKTE SSGOO DHAOR TINTP IUTPU LTAEA MEUTR NCALE OHNHE EOAML WYROH GINFE ETATA RNARG EHTWU ROSXX S
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
7) USUUO IYFRT ALHEO LGRUD TNMAN OEOAF CYSTN UGHOH UUOTH MRRSR VUNVA OUIEC EOIDC UNNYF NOWTT TOHLS SALBH WITRP EAOAN TLCBT IOBIL SYXLV SFEED IIRAE FHOOO EESTW RMIHE IMTNT GBYO
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
8) DIDSY NTDEG YTUHE TBHIO EEHRO YISNF SATWL ASIAM OIARK MPNLA EAWME DRRXT WESSA UDXER NNLYI DISOI DOYON HNUTE TBSYN HOATE EYWOM FTOWR TAORE YNYSN ERTHT TAAFC ARECO RHBAH IIOSA DUNWI LOPRM BLEEP DWOTH FDLIF OOBWR TSHOE
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
9) AIDBY UHOWL LLTOU COIRI LNNYE UWHLG NTVTO ROUHO NEEEG UDGBE RDTEY ANCEH TGBIE TEDNF ERHUA HNDGE NTAEE EDRAT AVRAF NHXEW ERLUN YTULN FLDII HOATW NHCLT IIOCL URSHN FIOOO DYMTT FYRUI OIRPM MYETT TPUOE ATUWD ARTYA ORNNR USCNN OTOEA BARKN YNHGR NAOAW YTFIM
=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=
10) TFIEH YTEMI OFRTL UOSDC COGOD ORNME WGIHN TTUNI GCVAC LAIOM EHODW TBARU OTERT FEESI LLAHT EDOSA JNAEE WDEBS LAHKD NYCER CMAES MAEOW UR

george4096

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  • Posts: 1
  • The Dead Sea Scrolls foretold this...
Re: Double Columnar Transposition
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2013, 02:15:45 PM »
Hi Phil

I am new to the forum and also like double transpositions. A couple of questions:
1) In the same key used for both transpositions.
2) Could you give a general idea of the key lengths. Are they less than 10, or around 10, 15, 20, or more.

I have developed a program for that, but this would take too much time to test 25 x 25 = 625 possible options for key lengths. Also, when I have an idea about the approximate key length, then based on the cipher text lengths, I can evaluate if at all there are chances of success.

Also, did you take the quotes accurately word by word/letter by letter, or should we expect deviations from the "official" known quotes. I am asking because a known plain text attach would also be an option, which wont work if the text is not exactly as expected.

Regards
George

Phil_The_Rodent

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Re: Double Columnar Transposition
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2013, 12:42:10 PM »
Hi George! Welcome to the forum.

Here are the answers to your questions:
1) No
2) No

What I can tell you is that the codes should all form neat rectangles. That means:
a) There will be padding, or dropped letters in the body of the cipher. There will be some deviation from clean text (or, if you dropped the resulting text into MS Word, a few words will have a red underline), but I don't think anything was badly mangled. Also, every text contains at least one name, which also may not be in your dictionary.
b) You do not have to attempt to solve for all numbers, just the numbers that will multiply out properly.
c) Passwords were randomly generated and would not be the same for both directions.

In regards to your program and an expansion of (b):
The first ciphertext is 144 characters.
144 will cleanly be divided into a table of the following proportions:
1 x 144, 2 x 72, 3 x 48, 4 x 36, 6 x 24, 8 x 18, 9 x 16, 12 x 12, 16 x 9, 18 x 8, 24 x 6, 36 x 4, 48 x 3, 72 x 2, 144 x 1

I would not have used x 1 permutations, so those can be tossed. This means you have a maximum of 13 possible tables sizes, down from 625. :)
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 01:03:33 PM by Phil_The_Rodent »

Phil_The_Rodent

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  • Posts: 41
Re: Double Columnar Transposition
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2013, 01:38:13 AM »
For the record, I went back to the original post (as I had quite forgotten the general details about these) and solved 3 of them by hand today (2, 3 & 5), and had done #1 a few months back. As they were all done at the same time, and the transpositions are generally clean, they should all be doable.

For anyone else wanting to give them ago, I found this tool: http://tholman.com/other/transposition/ which replaces my paper strips well enough. Still some work to do in notepad once the first tranposition is solved...
« Last Edit: December 04, 2013, 01:50:48 AM by Phil_The_Rodent »

 


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